Variklio galvos varstai vs spilkos

Bendros diskusijos apie variklius ir ju tuninga.
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Liutukas
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Variklio galvos varstai vs spilkos

Post by Liutukas »

Taigi , masciau masciau atsisedes aisku dabar cia nuskambes durnai , ir visi isvadins nemoksa bet noriu issiaskinti ar teisingai mastau , kai verzi galva su varstais tai kaip suprantu isitempia pats varstas (t.y. stresas sriegiui bloke ir paciam varstui) , o kai verzi per spilkas tai buna mazesnis stresas paciai spilkai ir sriegiui bloke ar kazka ne taip mastau , ir dar kai verzi su spilkom reikia verzt tiek pat kiek stockinius varstus ar kazkiek daugiau ?
Last edited by Liutukas on 19 Oct 2011, 23:53, edited 1 time in total.
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simioras
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Re: Variklio galvos varstai vs spilkos

Post by simioras »

tai kad galvoj sriegiu nebuna,gal turejai omeni bloke?
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Re: Variklio galvos varstai vs spilkos

Post by brakusa »

Ar špilka ar varžtas, sistemą sriegis-varžtas(spilka)-sriegis,veikia tokia jėga kiek niutonų sukuri raktu. Sukt reik tiek kiek reikia, o jeigu reikia sukt daugiau negu standartas, reikia tvirtesnių varžtų, kad įtemptas metalas nepavargtų. Tokia čia ir fizika...

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Liutukas
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Re: Variklio galvos varstai vs spilkos

Post by Liutukas »

simioras wrote:tai kad galvoj sriegiu nebuna,gal turejai omeni bloke?
Pasitaisau , taip bloke.
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Re: Variklio galvos varstai vs spilkos

Post by ard »

http://www.thomasnet.com/articles/hardw ... stud-bolts
Torque Efficiency

During engine assembly or maintenance, a bolt must be installed by torqueing it into place. Due to the head bolt’s design, it has to be rotated into its slot in order to engage the threads and secure it into place. This process creates both twisting force and a vertical clamping force, which means that when the cylinders within the engine’s combustion chamber begin accumulating load, the bolt will both stretch and twist. Because the bolt has to react to two different forces simultaneously, its capacity to secure the head is slightly reduced and it forms a less reliable seal in high-powered engines.

By contrast, a head stud can be tightened into place without any direct clamping force applied through the tightening. A stud can be threaded into a slot up to “finger tightness,” or the degree to which it would be tightened by hand. Afterward, the cylinder head is installed and a nut is torqued into place against the stud. The nut torque provides the clamping force, rather than the torque of the fastener itself, and the rotational force is avoided entirely. Because the stud is torqued from a relaxed state, the pressure from the nut will make it stretch only along the vertical axis without a concurrent twisting load. The result is a more evenly distributed and accurate torque load compared to that of the head bolt. This ultimately translates into higher reliability and a lower chance of head gasket failure.
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Re: Variklio galvos varstai vs spilkos

Post by Niokas »

pirma-varstas niekada nebus isuktas iki bloko dugno,nes jai pasiektu neprisiverstu.su spilka isnaudoji visa bloko sriegy padidindamas siriegio pavirsiaus plota ,ir sumazindamas jegas tiek y bloka tiek i spilka
tai labai aktualu turetu but visiem kurie vaziuoja su skarbonkes blokais arba verzia po 140nm+,nes rast istrauktas varsto sriegis nenaujiena.

antra -sukant varsta turi tris jegas, apatinio sriegio trinty ,trinty i galvos saibas,ir dar varsto susisukima kas yra pamineta virsuj.. niekada nebus tokia pat clamping force sukant tais paciais niutonais varstu ar spilka. ir zinoma dar reiketu nepamirs siregio zingsnio reiksmes, nes ne visos bet keleta performanciniu tikrai maciau spilku su smulkesniu siregiu negu blokas-tai automatiskai dar labiau viska sujaukia ir sukdamas tarkim 90nm varstu ir 90nm spilka gali turet kad ir 200% clamping force skirtuma

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Re: Variklio galvos varstai vs spilkos

Post by tonic »

Vat man irgi viskas buvo daugiau maziau aisku kuo smeiges geriau uz varztus, bet kai pasiskaitinejau apie sriegius nustojau suprasti :) Pasak protingos literaturos (nesugebejau ant greituju rasti nuorodos), pirmoji verzles sriegio apvija laiko ~37% itempimo, o 6 ar 7 jau gal tik 5%. Del to nera prasmes tureti labai ilgas verzles, kas yra smeiges atveju. Jei tureti smeige kuri eitu kiaurai visa bloka (nepamenu koks ten variklis taip turi, gal spade papildys), tai butu super, verziant bloka ar alkunini nesideformuotu blokas.

edit: nebuvau paskaites ard citatos, kuri visai neblogai paaiskina tai, ka jauti verzdamas ka nors su varztu verzle ir kai verzi sukdamas varzta, o ne verzle.

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Re: Variklio galvos varstai vs spilkos

Post by SR20DE »

is patirties...surenkant varikli nupirkau Erling naujus galvos varztus audi 10v blokui. Suverziau viska pagal tarpines ( Victor Reinz) nuorodas su Dyno raktu. Deja pakelus slegi virs 1,3bar, pradejo pusti ausinimo skysti per issipletimo bakeli ( rida ~1000km), nuemus galva, tarpine nerode jokiu nusidevejimo zenklu, o varztai atrode taip:

Image

Dabar esu susukes ARP smeiges, po kuriu visos bedos dingo...

P.S. varzhtam buvo naudojami 4 verzimo zingsniai pasiekiant 90NM. Verziant ARP po 3cio ( 90kampo) zingnio dyno raktas jau rode ~105NM :)

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Re: Variklio galvos varstai vs spilkos

Post by Eimazz555 »

[quote="SR20DE"][/quote]
Gera fotke, issisaugojau ja kompe kaip pavyzdi, kad parodyt ''ale'' meistrams kurie net dyzelines galvas verzia su senais varztais, nes realiai uzsiknisau kariaut su jais.

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Re: Variklio galvos varstai vs spilkos

Post by wanadoo »

tai cia reiskia kad tie elrig varztai fuflo kad pagal nurodymus verzei ir tiek issitampe?
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SR20DE
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Re: Variklio galvos varstai vs spilkos

Post by SR20DE »

wanadoo wrote:tai cia reiskia kad tie elrig varztai fuflo kad pagal nurodymus verzei ir tiek issitampe?
sunku pasakyti...kaip jau minejau, iki tam tikro lygio slegio kelimo viskas buvo ok, matyt nera pritaikyti 400ag+ ( kaip Niokas minejo 'clamp force' nepankamas) :)

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Re: Variklio galvos varstai vs spilkos

Post by Niokas »

:roll: seip mes vaziuojam su tikrai nemazais galingumais, ir nemazais slegiais cilindre,ir niekada nera buve nieko panasaus, as visgi manau kad cia buvo parke su paciu verzimu ir trinties jegom verziant , nes to vadinamo "head lifto" nebuvo ir su bustais iki 3baru su spilka m10/1,25 virsus prisukta 11-12kg, o arkliu ir torko ir zinoma pfp slgio tikrai buvo,o tarpine buvo paprastas paranitas po 50-70lt,ir niekas neprasipute ir samapalnos spilkos ir varstai po sei dienai naudojamos tos pacios...

p.s. beda kaskur kitur,aisku varstai blogis,ir jai dar minksti...
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Re: Variklio galvos varstai vs spilkos

Post by Laimis »

Ir siaip, dauguma nemegsta sriegiu prasivalyt bloke, o jei nauji varztai biski ilgesni ar pan ir ivyksta nesamones.
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Re: Variklio galvos varstai vs spilkos

Post by SR20DE »

svarbu, kad su smeigem beda issisprende :mrgreen:

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Re: Variklio galvos varstai vs spilkos

Post by fregis »

neseniai dejau naujus varztus, bet teko vietoj m11 m12, bet ir tai sukant jautesi kad 4 is 10 varztai sukasi kitaip virs 100 nm :roll: pries tai buvau seniau sukes senus, jie visai kitaip verzes nei sitie nauji :roll:
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Re: Variklio galvos varstai vs spilkos

Post by ard »

http://www.shop-pankl.com/bolts-1/
Image
Bolts with an asymmetric thread are used for conrods made of steel or titanium, which require a high bolt tightening torque. The difference between thread angles is 5°. In comparison to a symmetric thread with the same bolt’s geometry an asymmetric thread reaches a higher fatigue endurance limit. This derives from a changed loading / tension distribution.
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